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Rough Transcript:

This is a computer-generated rough transcript, so please excuse any typos. This podcast is an informational conversation and is not a substitute for medical, health or other professional advice, diagnosis or treatment. Always seek the services of an appropriate professional should you have individual questions or concerns.

How to Better Understand Your Sexual Values (And Your Partners)

00:00:05 – 00:05:16

You’re listening to the sacs with Dr Jess podcast sacks and relationship advice you can use tonight Welcome to the sex with Dr. Just podcast I am. Your Co host Brandon. Wear here with my lovely and under the weather partner. Dr Jess got a little bit of a raspy voice. I’ve lost my voice. Start Your sexy voice going on. Yeah I got a little cold but I think I also wore myself out singing karaoke. It was pretty epic Holiday Party that we had last week for our staff is included four and a half hours of Karaoke at our house screaming and I’m sure the neighbors offers were not pleased. Then he was fine but brandon was upset because he had to actually share the Karaoke mic with eighteen. Other people and just to touch on that quickly I wasn’t isn’t terribly pleased with the song selection. No I’m just kidding. Actually it was a lot of fun we did. We sang a number of ridiculous songs. Yeah Brennan in insane. Throw some D’s on. That did yes. I didn’t need the lyrics for that one. So it’s it’s holidays and I’m under the weather which is is a little disappointing but it happens when you go really hard when you take a break what happens your body is like oh I need to recover. Remember that thing. I’ve been fighting off. It is for you and this tends to happen for us quite frequently where it’s on our downtown that we end up getting sick and I think like you said it’s because you go so hard so oh any suggestions on what we should do next year to fix this nocco so hard so hard. Yeah it’s it’s been a nice holiday season. It hasn’t been too stressful. But I had some stress coming from some people close to me that ultimately I could have chosen not to take on. So that’s a lesson for next year recruit But it’s been a good one. We’re going into twenty twenty and what we’re thinking for today is that we’d like to talk about. Oh this sexual values questionnaire so a big part of my work involves distilling the research but also putting eating it into practice in creating tools for my groups and my clients to learn more about themselves. Learn more about their partner or partners and one one of the most. I would say most common formats that I offer in terms of tools involve questionnaires or interviews. So questions you you ask and answer with your partner. So you’ll come across many of these in flash cards in different quizzes and different APPS and so I continue to tweak mine every couple of months according to the groups and work with and this sexual values exercise comes from a recent event I did with all day fit which is a fitness group and practice in Toronto. But they’re a little bit different than a lot of other fitness groups. They’re really focused on community and on feeling good. They’re not focused on weight loss or a specific body type or anything like that. I mean if you WANNA get apps those support you in getting Ads but that’s not their their primary focus. I’d like to get one AB just one I have one AB. Can I get more. I’ll take one and a half APPs so in in this program that I designed for them we went through a number of exercises and the first one involved understanding your own sexual values because because again oftentimes when there is a deficit or frustration or challenge. intersex lives we looked our partner. We look to the relationship and many any of us have never had the chance to consider our own sexual values and so encourage people to take time to go through these sexual values questions on on your own end with a partner to help you understand yourself help you better understand your partner partners and just to give you context. This sexual values news questionnaire is followed up by a number of other questionnaires including one on relational desires and value. So the first part is about sex. The second part is about relationships We also have an intimacy interview which will probably do in an upcoming podcast. We have a time management discussion Russian. Because that’s a big topic about which couples fight and Dr Rachel Needle was actually talking about that just last week. How we fight about time? Money Sex and kids and now technology we also have an emotional expression activity and then finally Monogamy versus ethical ethical non monogamy discussion. So this is a series of questionnaires. We’re just GONNA go through the first one right now and I’m not gonNA provide too much context. I think it’s it’s probably a more interesting for me at least if Brennan and I just go through the questions together and answer them with one another honestly as a model of what it might look like of course yours could look entirely different different.

00:05:16 – 00:10:04

and that’s perfectly fine. We don’t have the gold star standard heard of relationship where we’re going through things like everybody else. Yeah I mentioned that to a family member yesterday who listens and it said that it seems like everything is a work in progress and I would agree that I think we’re all looking for quick fix whether it’s in health or mental mental health physical health work money kids time and what. I’ve really come to learn over the years. Is You just chip away a little bit heading in the right direction and eventually eventually you really start to reap the benefits of these activities but we live in a an environment society where we want a quick fix and unfortunately it’s not always like that. Yeah and we have to stop striving for perfection as well. Yeah that’s dangerous because I know that I was guilty of being. I’m a perfectionist when in reality that really hinders progress. Absolutely all right so we’ll get started with the sexual values questionnaire Janeiro. WE’RE GONNA post it on our website at sex doctor Jess Dot com on the podcast page. You can pick it up there and download it I think what we’ll do is just read through question by question and take terms it take turns answering them. I don’t know if we’re going to get through the whole discussion. It depends how much we talk. I might talk a little less than usual because this poor voice Lisa mine is just window recovers Brennan. You might do more talking. We’ll see how it goes and if we don’t finish the questionnaire will finish it next week. I I was GONNA keep this episode a quick episode because of the holidays but also because my little voice wants to recover if I don’t recover if I don’t let my throat throat cover. I don’t get to enjoy all the delicious food that we’re eating so my priority is food. y’All come second sexy voice feeling. Hey girl you want to come under this blanket with me. Hey Girl I just did a candidate the Dutch oven under the covers girl longer. So sexy your nostrils on that note so our first question in our sexual values questionnaire. I’ll let you answer. I Princeton. What messages did you receive about sex growing up? I’m going to sound very critical. I’m sure of my parents upbringing. Are you saying this and I didn’t receive many. I had a discussion that I recall and maybe I had others when I was probably sixteen. Sixteen seventeen around that age or maybe it was seventeen or eighteen. Where I my parents said to me? Don’t come home with a child. That was the bulk bulk of what I recall and like I said there may have been others but they didn’t sit with me in school. I went even though. I’m not Catholic. Doc I went to a Catholic School for the hockey team true. I went to play hockey hockey team so I played hockey for them for a few years. And this the message that I received from my school was the Through my religion class which was the rhythm method. And in retrospect that’s frightening because a fourteen fifteen sixteen year old boy that because that’s what I was a boy trying to coordinate ordinary with your partner. If you had one which didn’t which I did miss why which was my hand so it’s totally fine through. The method was whenever we felt like but if I had had a steady partner the thought of trying to coordinate with them their cycle so that we didn’t get pregnant and had nothing to do with Sexual Sexually Transmitted Infections Pleasure or pleasure at all. So you know I I eight. My messages weren’t very good in my opinion and it was only through Really attributing most most of my knowledge to you. And just you and your friends because when we met you or the one of the coordinators of the sexual What was it the Sexual Education Center with the University of Toronto? And you know obviously you guys were all very forward thinking very progressive awareness. And I think that’s when I started to really get the messages around healthy sexuality healthy sexual practices and then like I said at the beginning. This has been a process that you we’ve been together for almost two decades and I’ve learned.

00:10:04 – 00:15:01

I learned something new every day. So you learnt rhythm they’d can anyone imagine like a fifteen year old saying to their partner. How is your cervical mucus? Today yes wouldn’t have had any idea what that was still. Don’t go that well. Also I would imagine in the Catholic school cool because I also went to a Catholic junior school so I had a similar curriculum to you that they were teaching. Abstinence rhythm. Method was four within marriage. Yeah I mean. Abstinence was probably number one clearly. That didn’t resonate with me. Yes that was like. Yeah No let’s forget about that talk about masturbation because you talk about your right hand being in your partner. Did they tell you not to masturbate. No I don’t remember them telling me not to masturbate and they did again just did not register with me. It was very superficial very young. I don’t recall very much but I got through five years of religion and I couldn’t tell you a single thing about the Bible very few so what was taught to to me in that class did not I did not absorb Didn’t resonate with you. You might not have been listening. I definitely wasn’t listening. I was trying to keep my head down. So they didn’t call upon me to say anything in that class to say the Lord’s Prayer Right. Yes I remember all my prayers actually so when when you think about other messages was there anything around whom you should have sex with when it’s okay to have sex any of those sexual values who very deep question. They’re extending beyond what I was expecting you to ask of me There was was certainly a performance of masculine role that carried over from the sports that I played which is funny because there was a homoerotic element to to To sex within those sports when I think back on on it like it was there was stuff there like guys would joke around and stuff. I mean your fourteen years old and fifteen years old. You’re showering after hockey practice practice. You Play Sword Fights No. We didn’t please fights and it was just all of a sudden you’re naked with a group of guys you’re kind of forced to be be comfortable. You’re uncomfortable with comfortable with yourself because all of a sudden and again this is my experience to all of a sudden you’re all showing with a group of fourteen year old or or fifteen year old guys after practice because you stink and your parents are like. Don’t come in the car for an a two hour car ride back from wherever we were playing a game to go home and smelling bad so all of a sudden. You’re if you chose. You’re taking a shower after hockey and It was just different when you homo. Radically was joking around with it smacking of but it was stuff like that so it was joking around and smacking butts and crabbing crabbing somebody else from behind an joking pretending like pretending to to hunt not to hunt them and things like that And I don’t know yeah. That was normal or that was just the environment that we’re in but anyway that there is a performance element. There was also a lot of talk about in this case women There was the assumption by default that everybody was had roe. Do you think that some of that homo Russia’s joking around was rooted in Homophobia. Yes definitely laughing at the possibility. It was not something that I think most of us are not gonna be proud about but it was something that was a joke. It was funny. And how did anybody who I don’t know I’m not friends with a lot of those people that I played hockey with. It was so long ago but if any of them came out I wonder how our actions affected them and now that I think about it. It doesn’t. It’s not something that I would have been happy with. The the forty-one-year-old Brandon is certainly not happy with perhaps the fourteen or fifteen year old brandon about joking in impossibly. Making somebody else feel uncomfortable so I you know in reference to sports in the messages that were conveyed. It was very very very focused on heterosexual activity. It was very performance. You talked about the opposite sex and you you know what you what you who was hot and who wasn’t and it wasn’t I would imagine that it wasn’t in a very respect for way so I think it’s very important now. If we were to have a child that I would want to make sure that that young man or that young woman did speak and afforded respect respect to anybody that they were talking about at any given point of time so again messages that I learned now that would want to make sure conveyed to somebody else to make. Sure that there’s Respect I remember you talking about the idea that you’re supposed to be chasing sex as well as a guy. Yeah definitely grateful for it.

00:15:01 – 00:20:01

You’re always supposed to be chasing sex. At least again I was. My experience has had that work at house. It chased it a lot. I never caught it unless the catching of your own hand was something that you could aspire towards but no but even that language of chasing puts the onus of responsibility on guys to go after girls it I think reinforces the notion that you need to be aggressive. Says it reinforces the notion that the women young women are gatekeepers of sexuality. These these are messages. I also grew up with will again thinking about the toxic sick masculinity message that is reinforced through a Lotta these activities and again. I don’t play organized sports like I used to I. I still see the messages in the locker rooms being conveyed out when I go to hockey when I played yeah every now and then I’ll play and I still hear the messages. I don’t engage. I Have Spoken Haute and forced to put myself into awkward uncomfortable situations because as awkward as the people that are being harassed. It’s no no not not at all. I’m just saying that it is important when you have an opportunity to to speak out and to show that you do not support the the actions in the in the you know the message that are being thrown around misogyny that transphobia the homophobia now I mean this is just question number one. What messages did you receive about sex growing up? It’s interesting doing this activity with. You reminds me that I should probably break down these questions. But greater specificity for people to flush it out and I think sometimes looking to your past and and understanding some of the early messages and some of the messages that have been embedded in your consciousness and subconsciousness over. Time can help you to better understand yourself but also can help me to better understand like when I think about a very simple context of men being the pursuers and women being chased in the Hetero Atarot context which I acknowledge of course entirely exclusionary I can see why in relationships women expect the same right so I might I expect you to always initiate sacks because that’s what that’s the message with which I was raised and I think about in same sex relationship why sex I can be so much more fulfilling is because we don’t have to fall into these binary gender roles as as you know strictly as you might in a relationship like ours. When I think about the messages I received about sex growing up so I do remember vaguely that if Mike kind of touched myself I think my mom told me that it’s okay that it feels good at? I needed to do that in my room. Like I couldn’t do that. You know out on the public on the steps. Yeah used Rub against the The would you call them spindles of of the staircase of a staircase. And when when you do this as a kid you may not be doing it in the same way as an adult but I remember it felt. It felt relaxing felt pleasurable. I don’t remember number a ton of talk of pleasure. I was fortunate enough that my mom got me. Two Bucks one was called. What’s happening to me and one was called and Where did I come from and they were these little cartoons that explained lodden showed the different stages? I was definitely taught that sex was us to be relegated to the confines of marriage. I remember being really upset when I was maybe in Grade Eight and I have to tell you in grade grade eight sex was the farthest thing from my mind. I hadn’t even really kissed a boy until the very end of grade eight and it was like a kiss on the lawn with all of my friends watching through through the window and I was like Oh my God. Tongues are slimy. Remember thinking but I remember I wanted to go to a party and my parents were sort of discussing arguing about it. I could hear them and I remember one of them saying next thing you know you can. She’s GonNa come home and you’ll have a granddaughter water and I remember being so upset by that because I had I didn’t really underst- I understood. What sex was? But it wasn’t something I wanted to do. But what’s the alternative. Do you know what I mean like not educating your children about the implications of the ramifications of their actions I mean ultimately. There is the possibility of them. Coming home grinch right but saying don’t come home with. The kid is not adequate so we know that abstinence education fails sales to delay the onset of sexual activity. We know that comprehensive sex education that acknowledges that abstinence is an option and engaging in sex is an option we know the the comprehensive sex education leads to enacting healthier sexual behaviors like using a condom or a dental dam. Like saying. I’m okay with this but I’m not okay with that.

00:20:01 – 00:25:06

So we have a wealth of information suggesting that the more information you provide to young people the better equipped they are so when I think about about the messages I received about sex growing up it moves us into the next question. which is what messages do you wish to retain and which ones do you want to reframe or discard or deconstruct? And I one thing that I would have liked more more of is an acknowledgement of pleasure. So I’m lucky in that. I don’t think I grew up with shame around sex. I don’t think guy was told that it was gross or dirty. At least not by my parents by some of my friends I was. I do remember that when I opted in to having sex with with a boyfriend and have probably told the story before a friend of mine said tell me a slut. Tell me you’re not a SLAT. Tell me you’re not a slut. And she was she was joking around and I remember I had a condom hidden underneath the cotton of a paper jewelry box and I kinda wanted her to see it so that I could talk. Talk to her about it and we were. I would say we were kind of immature right. I I don’t think I was behaviorally immature. But maybe emotionally me and relational immature. I didn’t know how to have those conversations but I remember being. I guess you could use the word. slut shamed To be honest I didn’t feel like us let and my rationale for not feeling like a slut is pretty judgy to begin with because I was with a guy that I’ve been with for a long time and we loved each other and we talked about it and so I- rationalized my own decision according to cultural norms instead of simply acknowledging that Hey I’ve decided why did you do this. I feel good about it. This is my body and I have this option. I don’t know what messages I’d WanNa retained from my childhood or my adolescence. Because I don’t feel like I had enough opportunity to have meaningful conversations. I think I would have loved more. The opportunity to have discussions about options and effective ways of communicating needs and wants and desires years and You know ways to protect yourself. So how does it work for you when you first started having sex. I know it was with your with with a high school girlfriend at the or you were redone. High School wasn’t like I needed that. We had a grade thirteen back then. So it’s actually I for the folks today in Ontario Canada. We had a five year high school back when we were in school. So when you did start having sex did you talk about it. No we didn’t do any of that that that I recall it was something that just happened quickly. And there was no discussion leading leading up to it or after it and I’m sure that it made it awkward and uncomfortable. Actually I remember feeling awkward after because I felt. I don’t like the conversation had been had with her friends and I was self conscious. Let’s be honest for a second. How long the first session lasted lasted all sorts of things? I’m not sure how I could probably tell you. How many only have ten fingers yes But everything from how long to how good to how. Let’s be honest. How big I’ll all sorts of things that probably went through my mind and I remember feeling in Uncomfortable that I Group meeting after as to whether or not did she have a discussion with them. What are they thinking Thankfully the second time that we engaged it like lasted forever valley. Yeah which I thought was Super Weird Because you were nervous maybe perhaps but I forget what your question was about well. I don’t know I just asked about your first time. And and you’re saying you felt awkward. And what what. I what I’m wondering because we don’t need to you. Don’t have to rehash your childhood or your your teenagehood. Oh It’s it’s open book Brandon. Apparently on all these podcasts. The reason I I I think it can be useful as I think you carry some of those concerns and insecurities into your adult relationships like when we first met. Was that a concern for you. How long you last last it? No it wasn’t really no no it wasn’t and I don’t know why I’m not sure you always joked about it so I always thought it was something that concerns you will. I think it is a joke. I tend to joke around a lot. I’m you know I I I make fun of my myself. I think as a way to shoe diffuse the situation as I’ve always said under promise over deliver so but we joke around about that to alleviate at some of the tension so I still find myself doing that and I when we came into this relationship.

00:25:07 – 00:30:00

I didn’t really think too much about I had other insecurities authorities about the you know when you and I first met I. I was a bar back finishing university. I I didn’t have two nickels to rub together so there. Was this idea that I had about you that other. You know other people could offer you more that that I couldn’t so that insecurity really carried over I for the first probably handful of years that we were together and it took me a long time to become comfortable and thankfully I had you really reinforcing that that wasn’t important to you at all and I don’t know that if I had had that assurance that I would’ve you’ve felt as comfortable as I was and it was still something that I really grappled with. So there were other insecurities that weren’t necessarily search really related so when we go back to this question what messages do you want to retain. which ones do you want to reframe? I guess I’m thinking what comes to mind for me as I said I’d like to talk I would like I would have liked to have a bit more. Talk of pleasure I’m trying to think what else one thing one message. I received that isn’t specifically about sex but ties into sex is there was a lot of comfort with nudity in my house. Just yeah as you can imagine from having lived with my dad branded so I do remember my parents not walking around naked but walking to the bathroom naked kid and our house was really small so it was only a couple of steps but I. I think that made me fairly comfortable with bodies. Although I’m not totally comfortable always being naked with people It really depends on power dynamics. I was thinking back to when I was in school there. Are these different experiential exercises around sex. Were you know optional But when you’re studying sex you’re not just studying from I’m a book. You’re not just studying the theory. But I remember going to these workshops where you had the option to be naked in a hot tub and and have all these hands hands holding you up not in a sexual way at all in a more energetic way and I remember they were a couple of people in my class who made me uncomfortable. Who exercised their their power and privilege over me? Because I was a younger woman I was a woman of color. All of those things and I. I was really uncomfortable and I remember not getting naked and I remember thinking king. This isn’t like me what’s wrong with me. Why don’t I WANNA get naked? But I realize now reflecting back that when there are power dynamics at play a it really changes the way you feel about your body so I might go to desire resorts and get naked on the beach on the pier but if someone comes up to me and says there’s something that makes me uncomfortable. I’M GONNA WANNA wrap myself up. And in fact I’ve received messages on facebook from people who have made me uncomfortable where not not specifically at desire but at a different resort. I was naked and I guess this person was there and he sent me messages saying like. Oh you look beautiful in that photo auto but not as beautiful as you look on on the beach. bub-bubba what and that to me felt like I don’t know A violation because I’m not naked for your pleasure. So anyhow I guess that. That’s a bit of digression but That’s something I’d like to retain his body comfort or body neutrality or body positively messages judges I didn’t we didn’t talk with the nitty gritty of sex growing up. I’m lucky because when I use the word growing up that could be at any age so so in my late teens very early twenties when I started working at the sex Ed Center at the University of Toronto I became surrounded by people who are sex positive and who looked at the intersection of sex and age and race and and sexual orientation and gender identity and so so those messages were really empowering for me and those are messages that I wanted to retain that like you can be whoever you want. There’s no one right way to do it. What works for someone else may not work for another person? And so I think I’m pretty fortunate that at eighteen and Nineteen I was able to encounter some of those messages. And those are messages. I want to retain in that matter to me so I mean we spent a really long time on questions one and two which are reflecting upon the past so I think Some people may not spend that much much time. But I do find that talking about our past can be insightful. And there’s a lot more to be said but I think we can move onto the third question which is very broad in in scope.

00:30:01 – 00:35:16

But it’s what does sex mean to you meaning like what does it mean. What does it look like? What his sex? Oh Jeez I need to come up with an answer right now and I. I’m just being presented with the question. I’m delaying the choice. You can answer cancer or you can delay by singing. A song should probably answer So sex has changed for me and it continued. It’s a very dynamic Always thought of sex simply as the action as the physical action of having sex now. Oh I’m starting to understand and I have learned to understand that it encompasses so much more So I’m again. I’m just trying to find the words to express. Well okay. How about what counts as sex to you and I think that’s what I mean I mean to me was simply the action of having sex Sola Louis Penis and a vagina or or oral? Anything like that was was sex. I’ve learned that you you know sexy doesn’t have to be physical. I mean sex or sexuality starts in the mind so to speak and and creating that connection I also linked sex and love together as a as a child and that was something that I was taught and reinforced in school. That you had sex with somebody that you were in love with in that likely was part the religious element of my upbringing. I didn’t grow up here clear Once I started playing hockey as as much as I did at about the age of ten there was no no religion t to clarify Brennan went to Catholic school because Catholic schools are publicly funded here in Ontario meaning. They’re free so anybody that he can attend them and they had a better hockey hockey team. That’s the only reason I went to a Catholic school but in that environment and I think probably a bit at home the message was you have sex with somebody that you’re in love with. So I really grappled with having casual sex as an adolescent because I remember. We’re being thinking to myself that I need to be in a relationship to show this person the respect that’s needed to have sex with them so when I was in my late teens I remember bouncing in and out of a few relationships. I’m very sorry to those individuals that I that I did have fairly short relationships with I think because of my desire desire to have sex and also not hurt anyone’s like not do anything wrong as I had been taught so I jumped into into these relationships that weren’t going to work out. We had sex. Everything was respectful. But then you know six months or sorry six weeks eight weeks weeks twelve weeks later I was severing ties and not really. It wasn’t fair to the individuals that I was in those relationships with so I’ve been learning or the last number of years how sex can be an is can be a physical activity that can be completely separated from love and relationships oops. I’m not saying that I wholeheartedly feel like I can completely separate them What I mean is as if you’d asked me five years ago you could somebody be in you know in a relationship and having sex with multiple different people and still have a very breath strong healthy relationship with a partner? I would say well no. That’s it’s going to be very very difficult and now I see how well it can work when all all parties are open and honest and communicate about their needs. It doesn’t mean it works for everybody but it works well for some people and now if you Would ask me you know in this relationship would be okay. I think I’d grapple with a lot of that. I think it would be very difficult. And it’s not with the actual action action as I think it is so much the social element of judgement and a lot of other things that I think. Play in so Like I said from the beginning. This is a work in progress. I’m learning I’m always taking something new. And Very Informative Ode Code of these sessions. The people that we talk to and the the the the people that I follow the information that I I read up on because is there are some incredible people there that that I have met through you and through your work that are really opening my eyes to so many different things and it’s great it’s great to learn. It’s great to connect with those people because they bring a whole other perspective to Hugh my to my awareness and I don’t necessarily have to have those relationships but I can understand them and through Through there is so would you be able to sum up with sex means to you in any way totally got off topic.

00:35:16 – 00:40:07

No that’s okay Sitting that’s an I think you brought up something really important. The notion that we feel pressure to get into a relationship in order to have sex. And you don’t even really you’re not using the person you don’t realize that you might be using this person or you feel that you you can’t enjoy sex unless you’re in love with that person and so you force yourself to be in love being in love. Love of course is a very abstract term. It’s loving someone is kind of easy as a feeling but maybe not as easy as a verb and I did have a relationship ship with somebody when I was in my. I think it was twenty and I remember trying to communicate with her that I only wanted this to be a casual relationship chip and she agreed and it was casual for a couple of months but then there was a desire for her to want it to be more more of a relationship. And didn’t it fizzled. So that was my first attempt at having open communication and again this is twenty some odd years ago. Twenty twenty twenty one years ago so I think that the adolescents young adults anybody in their early mid twenties now or younger. They are more effective at communicating. I hear I see it. It’s like wow. You are so emotionally intelligent comparison to where I was at your age and your your ability to communicate so sex next to me is something that I see as an integral part of my life an integral part of this relationship. I’m learning to see it as a completely the separate entity that can be removed from a relationship And I also you recognize the benefits of a healthy sexual relationship both communication and the physical element. Yeah while we have research suggesting thing that sex is more satisfying in relationships than it is casually. That doesn’t mean that it doesn’t work for some people in different ways. So Vijay answer that question. What does sex mean to me? I think I’d answer it a little bit differently partly because my voices history innings while keep it brief probably more intelligent than what is not at Paul. Not at all Maybe a little more simplistic than what you said but sex to me is just anything. That’s pleasurable Physically physically so I’m not talking about eating which also pleasure but you’ll often hear her sex experts and therapist talk about the fact that sex doesn’t have to end in an workouts them but for me I really. I like sex to include not necessarily end but in in orgasm so it’s kind of anything that could potentially produced orgasm. That doesn’t mean I. I don’t enjoy sex if there is no orgasm because I really do enjoy it. I enjoy the connection. The physical closeness. I enjoy your pleasure Roger but to me. It’s not a specific act and in fact. I think we’ve worked through this over the years because you say that you weren’t concerned about kind of lasting lasting longer but I always felt that you and I still feel that you’re you don’t want to kind of finish and he’ll you know that I’ve had an orgasm Europe’s the goal so sometimes that can bother me. Yes we know not but for me. I don’t know it doesn’t have to be like intercourse. It doesn’t have to be oral. Can just be touching oftentimes. It’s talking even being held in certain ways with a certain amount of talker rubbing so sex to me is lots of different things And it certainly not just intercourse in fact intercourse might be kind of farther down my list of peak experiences. Some not always. Sometimes I really I really love it you looking at me it is really no. I’m just kidding I and even listening to you say this. It’s a again thinking back. Fifteen twenty years ago. I might take offence to that whereas now I’m trying to actively listen and hear what you’re saying so that we we can. It can be better the next time in understanding also that it doesn’t always have to be penetrative sex to be considered sex and it also doesn’t have to be a ten. I think there’s so much pressure for sex to be hotter and wilder you know Kinky are rougher or more tender or more passionate or more ecstatic and for me. That’s not not really. What sex is it can be all of those things that I love? When it’s all of those things but I also really enjoy just a tune-up where like passing listen through and it’s an oil change? A six session was a six is fine for like a to me.

00:40:07 – 00:45:07

I always you know. It’s sort of like pizza. People like how is the pizza even if it’s not the best pizza it’s still so it’s still better than a salad to me. I know other people enjoy solid. Good for you. So we don’t have a ton more time and my voice is wearing but this moves us into our fourth question. I actually thought we’d plow through More of this this this exercise so wrong question for which is also a broad question. How important is sex to you? Sex is important but its importance fluctuates based on. What else is happening in my life? So I know that it’s important for us to have sex. Excuse me for the connection for the the the release for the the the intimacy element but there are times where I’m stressed. I have a lot of my plate with work or with other commitments and it falls down it falls down the ladder in terms of its ranking. And I’m okay with that because I don’t feel like I need to necessarily always have it and I don’t need to be chasing. You have it three times a day every single day and for people who do feel that way. That’s amazing but for me three times a day. Oh don’t you have to work or something but come on. We’ve we meet people who due express. Excuse me a constant desire To be having sex three two three times a day and for them I if that’s what you WanNa do then do it but for me it depends on what I’ve got going on and Yeah I mean I guess that’s the answer your question. I can’t remember meeting people who want it three times a day. I think sometimes is performed of. I think sometimes it’s it’s in certain environments environments people will say things like that to demonstrate how strong and how like the desire constantly is and I care carefree. You and I am attracted to you and I think you’re hot and there are some times I I just don’t want to have sex because I got too much else so my mind and can’t get into it. Yeah I have the same experience I think I probably have an easier time compartmentalizing letting stuff go But yeah if there’s emotional stress in my life I’m definitely not thinking about sex. We’re a little bit different because I like to use sex to relieve stress and you like to be distressed before sex but we’ve kind of figured each other out in that respect where you know how to stress. I know how to support you in distressing. You don’t WanNa do one specific thing you can still like lend me a hand. Goes both ways. Yeah and the truth is when we we endeavor to lend one another a hand so I’m not in the mood. You’re in the mood. I’m like okay. Let me do this for you. Rotor Rotor can do that while I sleep. Because that’s perfect. I I do find that it puts me in the mood almost all the time and I find the same from you. Yeah I think when you’ve invested a little effort and the other person is willing to receive willing to understanding go with the flow then yeah it can both parties benefit So when I think about how important sex is to me you know I tend to think in numbers so if I had to rate it from one to ten. And what’s your number. Well I feel like if I say my number you’re gonNA cough yet ready on three one two three seven uh-huh okay. That was bowl. I was probably anywhere between seven seven and a half. Okay Yeah I’d say about seven There are days when I feel like it’s a nine and I never feel like it’s a ten. I never feel super desperate for it. I never feel as though it’s one because it’s always sort of on my mind. Signed as something that can feel good. It doesn’t mean I wanted every day. I definitely listen. I think I would want it every day if there was always something kind of new and and maybe a little bit anxiety provoking. ’cause I like that. I think I would want it every day if I didn’t have to do all the work or any of the work. Not all the works. It didn’t do everything no but if I didn’t have to do the work ’cause we I’ve talked about this before how of woken up having sex. We’ve both been asleep and I’m like. Oh my gosh. If that could have been every night when that happened that would be amazing. So yeah I would rate it as a seven and I think an important portent question to follow this one is why a sex important to you and we’ve touched on a on a little for me.

00:45:07 – 00:49:40

It’s the physical closeness. It’s the pleasure. It’s the release. It’s the I think the excitement and the fact that I for lack of a better word it feels like like something that I do uniquely with you right so it feels like something we share a of course ultimately it just I feel more relaxed and it feels damn good jeff just so good Yeah I’m pretty. Sure my answer’s in parallel yours. And I thought that was actually the one of my previous answers to one of your questions and I think other people will have other feelings for some people. It’s a spiritual experience for some people. It’s an expression of themselves. It’s tied title their identity. I wouldn’t say it is for me. I think people think Kuzma sexologist that you know I love sex more than anyone else or that. It’s super important to me. But that’s not necessarily the case. I I’m in this field because I believe that it’s a topic that if we address more adequately people will have happier relationships. It’s not really just about out having better sex to me. It’s all of the Kerala re benefits that come from being sexually confident that come from talking about sex and so the conversations we’ve done a few of them on the podcast in the past. We did the passion interview relatively recently. I find these these discussions enlightening for me and and so. I hope that you will give this sexual values questionnaire a try even on your own or with a partner. Some people find it really a useful to jot down their answers first and then bring it to the table to discuss with their partner. We only got through four of the eleven questions so next week. We’re on still on holiday. we’ll get through the next six or seven seven questions and will move maybe a little bit more efficiently. Yeah I think what we’ll do as well jot down their answers in advance just important for them and then we can bring them to the table. UNDISCUSSED ’cause I I find it really useful. Yeah I mean I learned a lot about myself reflecting looking back on my childhood my adolescent years and even some of the relationships. It’s great to be reminded of things that did and didn’t work so that you you can make sure that. So for instance in this relationship that we have right now. I’m I’m aware and doing the things that make it better because ultimately that’s what I want and I’ve come to realize it when this relationship is great so many other elements of my life Follow suit my work my other relationships because the foundation that I have with you you which is the most important relationship in my life. is great and I have you as a source of support and And that way when I need a little lecture time at work or I have something that POPs up and I wanna go to your supportive of me and vice versa and the data supports that when you’re happy in your intimate relationships where you’re familiar. Familial relationships then you’re happier and more fulfilled life and of course I acknowledge that not everyone’s interrelationship and if you have other close close social ties. You reap the same benefits if you have a very close best friend or a group of friends similarily. You might not have one partner. You might have multiple partners so brandon you talk about this as the foundation and and actually this is something we can talk about in the future that can feel like a little bit of pressure. Although we seem to have worked out you know fairly nicely sleep but for other people they have. Multiple sources of intimate relationships just like people can love multiple children. They can love multiple partners. And so I know folks out there listening Definitely fall into all of these various buckets and they’re custom designing and we’re all kind of you know working through it together so Thanks thanks babe for very slowly working through these questions. Thank you to you for listening. We are coming up on twenty twenty wishing you the happiest as season wherever you’re at had. Hopefully you’re getting a break feeling good with yourself. Feeling good with the people with whom you’ve surrounded yourself and a happy New Year for twenty twenty because I think when we come back it’ll be a brand new year so thanks for listening. Thanks to you babe thanks to desire resorts for their ongoing support of this podcast. Check them out at. What does your experience? And wherever you’re at we hope you have a great one. Hey Curl you’re listening to the sex with Dr Jasser podcast improve your sex life improve fear life.